(08-25-2025, 05:05 PM)F2d5thCav Wrote: If one considers the Russian state as a continuous entity extending from the time of the Tsars to the present day, there is only one example of defeat -- 1917.
Looked upon today, it means the only way Ukraine can 'win' (vice 'survive in some form') is to provoke the same kind of situation which brought down the Tsars.
Bringing down Putin and his fellow oligarchs is not impossible, but one has to reckon with the question of what comes in the wake of such an event. International communism was scarcely a reward for the collapse of the Russian Tsar system of rule.
russia has lost plenty of wars through it's history going all the way back to the rus/viking days. now did their leaders always figure out ways to get around those losses is another question.
here is a article that list 19 their loses,
19 Russian Wars Ending in Defeat, From Ivan the Terrible to Vladimir Putin
"Never trust a weapon that you haven't personally test fired"
Jack Reacher
Jack Reacher