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+--- Thread: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere (/showthread.php?tid=3172)
James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - gortex - 11-09-2025
TRAPPIST-1 is a Red Dwarf Star that hit the headlines a few years ago with the discovery of 7 roughly Earth sized planets in orbit around the Star 3 of which are in the Star's habitable zone , obviously when the Webb telescope was launched the TRAPPIST-1 system was the favourite of Alien hunters to go explore so a team of scientists booked some time on the telescope to take a look , at just 40 light years away they could be our neighbours.
The observations so far haven't been promising with TRAPIST-1 b and c having no atmosphere's due to their proximity to the Sar and d likely has a thin atmosphere for the same reason , last week the results for TRAPIST-1 e were announced ruled out a thin atmosphere or one dominated by Carbon Dioxide like Venus but there are indications TRAPIST-1e could have an Earth like atmosphere dominated by Nitrogen , water , CO2 and Methane.
TRAPIST-1 is a small dim Star and the planet is likely tidally locked to its parent due to proximity but life could exist in the band between the light and dark side of the planet or heat from the light side could be transferred by the atmosphere so life could exist in the shade of the Star's flares , TRAPIST-1 is estimated to be up to 10 Billion years old so may not be as boisterous as it was as a youth.
15 more observations of TRAPIST-1e are planned before December so I guess the data is quite interesting , expect more detail early next year.
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - Kenzo1 - 11-09-2025
Well the place look`s promising , but there is no way to reach it .
Cant they try finding places more near us ?
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - F2d5thCav - 11-09-2025
(11-09-2025, 04:41 PM)Kenzo1 Wrote: Well the place look`s promising , but there is no way to reach it .
Cant they try finding places more near us ?
The other challenge will be to find life that has not gone extinct. Be ironic if Trappist E had ruins of a former civilization on it.
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - gortex - 11-09-2025
(11-09-2025, 04:41 PM)Kenzo1 Wrote: Well the place look`s promising , but there is no way to reach it .
Cant they try finding places more near us ?
We have a way to reach it mate but it would take a long time , with an ion drive powering a spacecraft at a constant 1g it would take less than a year to achieve near light speed , then we'd have to wait 40 years for the signal our probe sends back to reach us.
Proxima Centauri b , 4.5 Light Years away , its in its star's habitable zone and it's a bit bigger than Earth , I'm guessing that'll be our first extra-solar destination.
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - F2d5thCav - 11-09-2025
Has anyone even got a concept for a functional ion drive ? Sounds like something Musk would be interested in deploying for grins.
ETA: https://patents.justia.com/patents-by-us-classification/60/202
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - Kenzo1 - 11-09-2025
(11-09-2025, 05:45 PM)gortex Wrote:(11-09-2025, 04:41 PM)Kenzo1 Wrote: Well the place look`s promising , but there is no way to reach it .
Cant they try finding places more near us ?
We have a way to reach it mate but it would take a long time , with an ion drive powering a spacecraft at a constant 1g it would take less than a year to achieve near light speed , then we'd have to wait 40 years for the signal our probe sends back to reach us.
Proxima Centauri b , 4.5 Light Years away , its in its star's habitable zone and it's a bit bigger than Earth , I'm guessing that'll be our first extra-solar destination.
I dont think i see this in my lifetime i'm afraid
Last time America was in Moon was 1972 . They should speed up litle bit is my sincere hope .
(11-09-2025, 05:59 PM)F2d5thCav Wrote: Has anyone even got a concept for a functional ion drive ? Sounds like something Musk would be interested in deploying for grins.
Romulan empire ? or....klingons.
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - gortex - 11-09-2025
(11-09-2025, 05:59 PM)F2d5thCav Wrote: Has anyone even got a concept for a functional ion drive ? Sounds like something Musk would be interested in deploying for grins.
ETA: https://patents.justia.com/patents-by-us-classification/60/202
NASA used ion thrusters and engines on the Dawn spacecraft which went out to investigate Dwarf Planes Ceres in 2007 then on to Vesta , I think with new technologies like ion engines and AI to pilot a craft we are getting closer to sending a spacecraft out there to investigate potential neighbours , perhaps 3I/Atlas is such a craft checking us out.
Quote:Two ion propulsion engines are required to provide enough thruster lifetime to complete the mission, and the third engine serves as a spare. Since launch the spacecraft has used each of the three ion engines, operating them one at a time. Dawn will use ion propulsion with interruptions of only a few hours each week to turn to point the spacecraft's antenna to Earth. Total thrust time to reach the first science orbit will be 979 days, with more than 2,000 days of thrust through entire the mission. This surpasses Deep Space 1's 678 days of ion propulsion operation by a long shot.
The thrusters work by using an electrical charge to accelerate ions from xenon fuel to a speed 7-10 times that of chemical engines. The electrical power level and xenon fuel feed can be adjusted to throttle each engine up or down in thrust. The engines are thrifty with fuel, using only about 3.25 milligrams of xenon per second (about 10 ounces over 24 hours) at maximum thrust. The Dawn spacecraft carried 425 kilograms (937 pounds) of xenon propellant at launch. Xenon was chosen because it is chemically inert, easily stored in a compact form, and the atoms are relatively heavy so they provide a relatively large thrust compared to other candidate propellants. At launch, the gaseous xenon stored in the fuel tank was 1.5 times the density of water. At maximum thrust, each engine produces a total of 91 millinewtons—about the amount of force involved in holding a single piece of notebook paper in your hand.
https://science.nasa.gov/mission/dawn/technology/ion-propulsion/
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - EndtheMadnessNow - 11-10-2025
I've thought if they ever get the physics figured out for nuclear fusion reactors beyond concept phase that may be our ticket outta here.
Look, Wile E. Coyote used an Acme fusion-powered rocket backpack way back in the 1950s. Chuck Jones held the original patents. Maybe we can fire project Orion back up.
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - F2d5thCav - 11-10-2025
(11-10-2025, 04:28 AM)EndtheMadnessNow Wrote: I've thought if they ever get the physics figured out for nuclear fusion reactors beyond concept phase that may be our ticket outta here.
Meanwhile, an SS-Obersturmfuehrer smiles and winks from several light years away.
RE: James Webb observation shows TRAPIST 1e could have Earth like Atmosphere - Ninurta - 11-10-2025
(11-09-2025, 04:41 PM)Kenzo1 Wrote: Well the place look`s promising , but there is no way to reach it .
Cant they try finding places more near us ?
They are trying, but it's not as easy as it sounds. Other star systems have random tilts with respect to Earth. For example, the Solar system we live in is tilted at 62 degrees from the galactic plane, and rotated away from the galactic center
We could be looking at many closer habitable systems, but given that their orbital planes may not align with our line of sight such that the planets pass in front of the star from our viewpoint, we have no way of determining whether they have an atmosphere at all, much less what it may be composed of if they do.
We could be looking at them from the pole down rather than on edge. In that case, we would detect q wobble in the star, but have no way of knowing what any potential atmospheres are made of. We would know "something" is there, but not what, exactly.
While there are ways to reach such places, those ways are not "fast". We could accelerate to near light speed with current tech, but that carries a huge risk of ramming an interstellar body such as 3i Atlas, or Oumouamoua, or even something larger like a rogue planet, at light speed. If a 60 mile an hour (about 90 KPH) car crash into a wall is likely to kill you, just imagine what a 300,000 kilometer per SECOND ( 1.08 BILLION KPH) crash would do. Even tiny dust specks at such speeds are thoroughly dangerous - and you would be on the body almost as soon as you detected it at light speeds. You'd be "there" long before you had any time to react to it.
So, slower speeds and much higher travel times are the way to go. Something speculated as "generational" star ships would be in order - star ships whose inhabitants would undergo generations, perhaps hundreds of generations, before reaching their destination.
In terms of human life times, 80 generations (2000 years @ about 25 years on average per generation) or so takes us back to roughly the time of Christ. Imagine the changes that would be wrought over 100 or 200 generations aboard a generational star ship. 200 generations would take us back 5000 years, to 3000 BC... before the Age of Gilgamesh (roughly 2750 BC)... back to a time when only small pockets of humanity were just starting to climb out of the Neolithic into the Chalcolitic and small scale farming was starting to take hold in small areas of humanity..
Would the descendants reaching the destination even remotely resemble culturally their ancestors that initially set out on the journey? They would be as far removed from us as we are from our Bronze Age or even Stone Age ancestors.
Robert A. Heinlein wrote a novel about such a journey. It's called "Orphans of the Sky". Highly recommended reading.
Another link to a different edition of "Orphans of the Sky"
.